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2015 ISR rules already being dictated by the OEM'S?

2015 ISR rules already being dictated by the OEM'S?

Postby Bob Vehring » March 18th, 2013, 8:27 am

Mike, I think at least several of us are talking about the same thing here. In the last decade or so, one thing has happened that has had an effect on everything we do, were talking on that now. Certainly it is a powerful force, but we have to accept that there are far more people willing to bravely type away, then actually go out and work at fixing an issue. That alone will sometimes bit you.
Sorry once again I have to point to karting, but thats the only thing I really have to work with. For over 5 years, there was a growing demand from our racers to build, storage locker/garages for them to rent to race out of, we do have 20 races at our local track.. By last fall it seamed we had the commitment to move on this. We formed a comm. to do the work, had the plans drawn, builders lined up, we committed 84K to the project then, a month ago we debuted the drawings and plan at out swap meet. Then a funny thing happened, to move the plan to the county, we asked all these people for a down payment of $350 to secure their unit. In the last month we have down payment from exactly 3 of these people.

I think everyone will agree, we need to move forward, we need to attract serious sponsorship. The hard part will get everyone to agree on who these people will be, and how they should approach it.
BTW, If anyone needs plans and drawings for a 28 unit storage building, let me know, were not using ours
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2015 ISR rules already being dictated by the OEM'S?

Postby Bob Vehring » March 18th, 2013, 8:35 am

[quote=proton]Part of the problem is most of these snowmobile racing organisations are run by the membership/volunteers or a board of directors....in my opinion, to do what you are talking about, these organisation would be better off privately owned or at a minimum, sell off the marketing rights to a private individual because history has shown us the membership run organisations always vote for what is in their garage and not what is best for the sport...spec fuel is a good example....NASCAR doesn't ask its race teams what they want for rules...its all about relinquishing control.[/quote]

AGREE 100%

or what you sayin is run like the largest race in out sport is run
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2015 ISR rules already being dictated by the OEM'S?

Postby prochamp » March 18th, 2013, 10:18 am

PROTON

True Nascar may dictate to there Teams what they run, but thats the ELITE series like our champ

The Local run circuits CRA, ARCA Ect all run there own rules not NASCAR.

Just because MIRA runs Enduro doesnt mean they have to follow a specific set of rules other then the Safety Rules. Just like they do now. Thats where they need to be in control of there own needs as long as it aligns with the core Safety and Insurance regulations. Enduro rules should be the same every where, same for the Sprint Classes so competitiors can go between circuits to run without major changes.

Right now how many Bandit races are being run without ISR sanctioning and paying there way but using the ISR rulebook for there own rules. These are the people who need to be contacted and not allowed to use the rules for there own agenda without paying the fee for there use
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2015 ISR rules already being dictated by the OEM'S?

Postby watcher » March 18th, 2013, 10:28 am

"Right now how many Bandit races are being run without ISR sanctioning and paying there way but using the ISR rulebook for there own rules. These are the people who need to be contacted and not allowed to use the rules for there own agenda without paying the fee for there use"

AGREE 100% With you prochamp

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2015 ISR rules already being dictated by the OEM'S?

Postby Bob Vehring » March 18th, 2013, 12:32 pm

Terry, can you stop it? Believe me, I'm on your side but a National group in our sport was hit with a C and D order and were back in a month with just some wording change
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2015 ISR rules already being dictated by the OEM'S?

Postby fast dad » March 18th, 2013, 4:45 pm

I agree that it is done to some extent. I see Jerry at every oval race, as he has for the last 35 years. I don't want to replace them they need to be treated like so called God fathers, or Wise men. With out there presence and dedication who knows if there would be a snowmobile race series. What I would like to see is having the 4 wise men receive there just due finically. This must come from adding sponsors and in turn more racers. To do this we need to make sure that the racing is great and fair. Letting the manufactures control the rules will spell nothing but demise. I am sure they would agree to some extent. Most if not all the salaries are funded by the manufactures. They should not have to rely on that. Making the sport grow makes everyone grow, including the manufactures. My point is some one/commissinor needs to have a vision/plan to help everyone. As I said before the less involvement, other than some support to all racers, the better the racing will be. Right now all the manufactures money, time, exposure is in ISOC. The rest of the racing series is more or less on there own with smaller help. Looking at there side, manufactures, they get the biggest bag for the dollar with ISOC. Is it because the sleds are similar to production?? Sort of, you cant buy a sled that looks or has the same parts from your dealer that races in Sno Cross..

Maybe I am way off base, and should be a by stander, but I have seen many high profile racing in the last 15 years, and snowmobile racing is more exciting than any other type of racing to me and I would like to see it grow where it should be... growth can scare more people than the ones who would like to see it grow. it is just my nature to make things better than they are, just like any race sled, racer you can always make it better, and if you don't you will get beat by someone who does want it better...

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2015 ISR rules already being dictated by the OEM'S?

Postby Bob Vehring » March 19th, 2013, 2:25 am

I just don't think you would fit well as a bystander :) 20 some years ago my kids were racing karts against his kid, I'm guessing Danica was about 16 when you left for the car world and of course been through every part of it.
That kind of knowledge base, seeing what makes some series succeed, others fail is something very very few people get to see. Its also the knowledge and past history that could help this sport, now, from taking some wrong turns.
Keep talkin
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2015 ISR rules already being dictated by the OEM'S?

Postby proton » March 19th, 2013, 5:45 am

Years ago when F1 was losing its way from a organisational and promotional/marketing stand point they sold all marking rights to Bernie Ecclestone who at that point in time was a race team owner. He quit racing, his primary function was to organize and promote F1. He didn't make the rules, the FIA did, because he knew that racers are very poor at making rules that will build a good show. he developed the concord agreement and all teams who wanted to take part in his road show signed their names giving all marketing power to him for the betterment of F1...look what it is today, car manufactures are spending hundreds of millions of dollars building cars and engines that dont resemble anything on their show room floor, because Ecclestone has built something worth their involvement.

Guys I hate to say it...but that is what CHAMP racing needs, for example:the TLR cup is kinda there but Tommie Lepar would need total power and control to market champ like Ecclestone did to send champ into the bigtime ...not saying that he is the guy, but just using him as an example...ISR is still there...the promoters are still there....the local racing groups are still there....but champ has no Bernie Ecclestone like Tj is talking about to build the sport to what it could be.


Tj hit the nail on the head when he asked who is the person that television talks to, to put champ on TV
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2015 ISR rules already being dictated by the OEM'S?

Postby prochamp » March 19th, 2013, 6:49 am

Television would be great, but really what show do we have right now thats Television worthy??
Yes champ racing is great, but its sure not got the show needed for television revenue, and the sports not just about Champ sleds.
We have One Champ show currently big enough for television and its really not there. We dont have fan participation, and thats what drives media coverage,is fan base. If we dont start at the grass roots and get the Spectator appeal up, there will never be Television coverage, as they wont be able to sell advertising to cover the cost of production. The OEMS use to pay for the media coverage and still are for SNOWCROSS. Take that away, NO SNOWCROSS, same as what has happened to oval racing. What adds do you see running during the Snowcross productions???? WE have to look deeper into what drives the Fans, to be able to sell Television coverage. Do we really have that???
Yes TJ or Tommy Lipar would be great Commissioners, but will the current interest of our sport step up and get behind the idea of this type of change or leadership?

TJ has a ton of insite and experience for sure, but if all we are worried about is television coverage for champ sleds where does that leave the sport?
Any ideas TJ, you must have vast knowledge of what it takes to sell the Sponsors and media.

We have strayed away from the original post but hey its all relative.
How do we get people involved? Both Competitors and Spectators?
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2015 ISR rules already being dictated by the OEM'S?

Postby Bob Vehring » March 19th, 2013, 7:56 am

Take a look at this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uUcz8EHbIl0&feature=youtu.be
The cost of making that was just about nothing. We talked about needing something like this to promote the new Briggs class. Dave found some students at UWM taking Photography classes, they jumped at the chance to produce something, the engine intro is stock Briggs footage, everything else they did. The costs were driving them up to a race, a motel room and maybe a few beers were involved. That vid was played on the live ISOC streaming all weekend long.
We have to stop finding reasons why we can't do something, and finding ways we can
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