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Outlaw 600 - Progress Thread - HRE

Outlaw 600 - Progress Thread - HRE

Postby jhooper/HRE » April 1st, 2011, 1:43 am

It was too slushy to turn laps yesterday and we are getting a snow storm today so I guess testing is done. I will be bringing the Outlaw sled to Cornwall around 4pm saturday for the EPT banquet. The sled is going to Art Attack signs for some graphics today and we will post more pics soon. John H.
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Outlaw 600 - Progress Thread - HRE

Postby lynxer » April 1st, 2011, 4:28 am

Dying to see pics of the sled with the body on it!!!!!
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Outlaw 600 - Progress Thread - HRE

Postby jhooper/HRE » April 1st, 2011, 5:13 am

We inspected the gearbox after around 200 laps and found no measurable wear on anything so I think we will spec the 1 inch wide solid steel Midget quick change gears for the final drive and just leave a little wiggle room {FOR CREATIVITY} on the case, chain and sprockets leading to the Midget gears. These gears are around $60 per set and are available in a very wide range and should last forever in this aplication. I used a 6 1/4 center to center distance on this sled but found that 6 5/8 would be best to keep the driven clutch from contacting the driveshaft brg. hsg. when shifted thru.
The next one will use the same 19/26 x 15 wide chain and sprockets @ 3 5/8 center to center with a 42 pin chain instead of 40.
I will be working closely with Jaws to develop 1 spec pipe that works as equally as possible on all three engine brands. John H.
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Outlaw 600 - Progress Thread - HRE

Postby Flatout » April 1st, 2011, 6:30 am

I think you should source a CNC shop like Polar Motorsports to do a standardized "spec" CNC billet case to house the gears and chain. Have someone like Micro Belmont make a standardized "spec" set of shafts as well. This way parts would be readily available as "off the shelf" standardized spec parts. Having a supplier for ready made complicated parts like that would make it so much easier to organize a build. And it would be handy for having "spares" at the track.
The plentiful and cheap availability of the different ratio gears will make it easy to tune for different tracks.
I love it when a plan comes together!!!!
HG
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Outlaw 600 - Progress Thread - HRE

Postby PDRacing » April 1st, 2011, 9:27 am

.
Richard Scroggs #13 EPT
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Outlaw 600 - Progress Thread - HRE

Postby proton » April 1st, 2011, 10:03 am

How wide is the tunnel?
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Outlaw 600 - Progress Thread - HRE

Postby Ski-DooRon » April 1st, 2011, 1:36 pm

Ok now that this outlaw 600 sled has seen some serious testing John you did a great job for such a short time nice job,other than crash scenarios, has anyone ever thought of how many laps it would take, being these will have a rolling start to have enough time for guys in the back to make it to the front.Also the snow dust is going to be far more of a factor than most think with a rolling start of 20+ sleds,has any thought of determinaning starting positions been thought of,{draw,time trials etc.}.We all know that snowdust is terrible to see through.That will be a factor.
If you look at the difference between the Davco sled and Johns sled {I know he said he could not get materials he wanted in such short time} the triangulation in front of the drivers feet on the Davco sled,and the seamless tubing used is far more protective to the drivers legs and driver compartment, also he has the rollcage incapsulating the tunnel which inevitabally makes it haeavier but also safer and stronger in protecting the tunnel and {clutches/chaincase whichever } in a crash scenario.I hope you are also thinking of the types of drive systems for these sleds because if you all don't know there is a drive system to drive from the rear axle of the suspension,there is no more of a cost factor driving from the rear than the front axle, ok maybe someone else making the system to purchase from thats it .
The davco sled has the clutches in the driver compartment, with the proper clutch enclosure will never be an issue,{Who has the final say on the rules?}.As far as a radiator out front they will be wiped off time and time again,why use them?Use the Black flag instead.
My last thought on the cost, these sleds should never cost {with engine} anymore than the $12000 price tag for a fully equipped dirt modified race car minus the engine.Just my opinion.
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Outlaw 600 - Progress Thread - HRE

Postby prochamp » April 1st, 2011, 2:03 pm

Why not worry about snow dust when it is an issue. We have used rolling starts at MIRA for YEARS and Years and SNOW DUST is seldom an issue. There are many ways to control snowdust that can be applied to the racing surface

Get the class going before worring about racing issues that are a guess. Radiators in front will not be an issue either, ran them for years with the SKIDOO sno pro sleds never had one destroyed.

As far as tubing and structure, seamless tubing is not always better. Same goes fort chrome moly tubing can be much more brittle and if not welded correctly not as stong as welded seam tubing.

Chassis Design will need to be looked at as the class gets off the ground. We built mini champ cars also for years and found out that using to strong of a roll cage was dangerous upon impact, it broke and became a spear, instead of bending and ABSORBING Energy during a crash. These issues can be beat to death, but regardless of how they are spec'd they will be safer then a open champ sled
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Outlaw 600 - Progress Thread - HRE

Postby proton » April 1st, 2011, 3:29 pm

Think about it....park your Ford focus sideways on a free way and get T-boned at 70mph and tell me what the chances of you walking away without injuries...we drive these cars every day with road vehicles coming at us head on with closing speeds of 110-120mph about every 30-45 seconds...we cannot build a 100% safe racing vehicle, we can do the best that experience and science allows us to....John said it earlier...some one will eventually get hurt or killed in one of these, but it IS safer than what's out there now.

Pro-champ is right about building these things too rigid... that's why the best thing to do is follow a blueprint that is out there...Sports Car Club of America has been racing prototype cars for years and have DEVELOPED rules that have proven to be safe as far as a race vehicles is concerned...the outlaw 600 has been built to these standards....this is a good thing, just a glimpse of things to come ....ice oval racing will never be the same... truly reborn
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Outlaw 600 - Progress Thread - HRE

Postby Bob Vehring » April 1st, 2011, 5:41 pm

Chassis building now days is not black magic and its not guessing at it anymore Its basic engineering. The car people have done the home work, what has to give and what shouldn't give is well known. Fuel classes in Drags withstand 300 mph chrashes as does NASCAR,Indy, FI. Study their rules, scale the dementions down to our size and weight. There are books out there specificly on chassis building and cage construction. And add a fire bottle system, regaurdless of where you mount a tank or cell the possibility of fuel getting out is always there, the drivers clothing will absorb it, you need something to smother it before the saftey crew gets there.
Bob Vehring
www.4cyclecentral.com
www.120sledracer.com
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